Buffy - Season 4 impressions (episode 11)
Nov. 20th, 2005 06:08 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
thalia_seawoodDoomed
A summary can be found here.
- Buffy really shouldn't be angry at Riley for not telling her about his double identity. I mean she's kept her secret as well. - But then her anger/disappoinment is not really about his double life. She feels that way because she finally wanted to have a normal relationship with a normal guy. (We've already seen that she would love to be a normal girl with a normal boyfriend in I Will Remember You on Angel. Buffy has forgotten about saying this, of course, but the wish is still there.)
- Amazing. Riley has never heard of the Slayer myth before.
Buffy: " [...] Look it up: Slayer comma the."
- It makes perfect sense that Buffy's scared of earthquakes. Dying on your 16th birthday will do that to you.
- Ah, parties at college. :-)
Willow: “Well, Porter dorm is completely blacked out. So naturally they are dealing with the crisis the only way they know how: ‘Aftershock Party’.”
Buffy: “Ah, this from the dorm that brought us the ‘Somebody Sneezed’ party and the ‘Day That Ends in Y’ party.”
Willow: “They do seem to be pretty generous with the milestones.
- So the Iniative considers demons to be like animals. It seems to me they haven't understood very much. The Council is not much better in that regard. The difference between these two institutions is that one is high tech and the other old fashioned. But both know nothing about their enemies.
After we've met Angel, Spike, Drusilla and Harmony amongst others one thing is certain: No vampire is alike. Without souls/chips they are dangerous predators, but they are still capable of feeling a wide range of emotions. Occasionally they are capable of love.
And nobody who's met Doyle could say that all demons are evil.
- Willow at the party: I totally sympathize. I hate going to parties without knowing anyone.
- O dear. Spike's new outfit is not really him. - The scene reminded me of the TNG show Deja Q where Q is forced to wear a hideous green jumpsuit. - To both Spike and Q appearances are very important though for slightly different reasons. Spike needs to be cool and Q needs perfection.
- Xander: “That’s it! I am way past due with you. I hate to break it to you, oh impotent one, but you’re not the big bad anymore, you’re not even the kind of naughty. You’re nothing but a waste of space – my space! And as much as I always got a big laugh watching Buffy kick your shiny white bum, as much as I know I can give you a little bum-kicking myself right now, I’m here to tell you something (He steps forward, right under the drip of water from the leaky pipe) You’re not even worth it. - I’m out of here.”
Xander's little speech to Spike must cut quite a bit. IMO, this is the first time you can catch a brief glimpse of William behind the Spike persona.
I mean we have seen Spike moaning over losing Drusilla, but in a way he was always in control. He was still Spike.
In this scene with Xander it becomes very clear to him that he's back to square one. Not only is he unable to be a vicious fighter, but he's also lost his cool. And all of a sudden, he's not so different from William, a persona he's tried to leave behind.
- Giles gets a wonderful line I'll have to memorize:
Giles: “I’m so very sorry. My contrition completely dwarfs the impending apocalypse.”
- During Riley's and Buffy's talk(s) I found this line very poignant:
Riley: "But I’m, by God, not going to walk away because I think it *might* not work."
I heart Angel, but that's more or less what he has done. Yes, yes, ending the relationship was all for Buffy's good, but as she says in this very episode she probably not getting older than 25. Shouldn't she get to decide with who she wants to spend her remaining years?
Riley: “Welcome to the story of the world. Things fall apart Buffy. And evil – it comes and goes. But the way people manage is, they don’t do it alone. They pull each other through. If you weren’t so self involved you’d see that. [...] But mostly I think you want to stay down in that dark place (Buffy stops to look at him and he steps in front of her) because maybe it’s safer down there.”
I don't agree with everything he says - Buffy's flaw is not that she's too self-centred, but apart from that he makes some valid points.
- Once more we get to see the difference between meetings of the scoobie gang and of the Iniative. The Initiative mostly concerns itself with measurements. Giles, Buffy and co. do their research in ancient books.
- I can't take Spike's suicide attempt too seriously. Yes, he feels useless, but if he really had tried to stake himself he could simply have put the stake into his heart. There's absolutely no need for the elaborate setup. I therefore view his suicide attempt as a cry for help. ;-)
- Love Xander's encouraging comment:
Xander puts an arm around Spike’s shoulder as they walk towards the steps: “Think of the happy. If we don’t find what we’re looking for, we face an apocalypse.”
Spike: “Really? You’re not just saying that?”
- Spike manages to get back to Xander and Willow. They've seen him when he was down - and Willow has dared to pity him. Since he can't bite them, he uses his next best weapon: Words.
Spike: “I should think you would be glad to greet the end of days. I mean, neither one of you is making much of a go at it. (Gestures at Xander) You. Kids your age are going off to University, you’ve made it as far as the basement. And Red here, - you couldn’t even keep dog-boy happy. You can take the loser out of high school, but...”
Willow: “I see what you’re doing. You’re trying to get us to dust you.”
Spike: “Am not! I just don’t want pity from geeks more useless than I am.”
Willow: “We’re not useless! We – we help people. We fight the forces of evil!”
Spike: “*Buffy* fights the forces of evil. You’re her groupies. She’d do just as well without you – better I’d wager, since she wouldn’t have to go about saving your hides all the time.”
Xander: “That is no not true! We’re part of the team. She needs us.”
Spike: “Or you’re just the same tenth grade losers you’ve always been, and she’s too much of a softy to cut you lose.”
Willow and Xander stand there speechless and after a moment Spike turns and walks on a satisfied grin spreading over his face.
I just knew he would use Willow's feelings for Oz at one point. The mark was just too good to miss.
- Spike finally realises that he can fight other demons and wins back his self-esteem. He totally defines himself by his fighting skills.
It's perfectly in character that he's fine with fighting other vampires/demons. Back in his pre-chip days, he also didn't get along with other vampires and had no scruples killing them, e.g. the "Annointed One". He's only loyal to himself and also Drusilla to a certain extent.
- I don't care for the final stunt, i.e. the last demon jumping into the hell-mouth, Buffy jumping in behind him and miraculously catching up with him in free fall. Very strange and defying all the laws of nature.
- Funny to see that Riley doesn't know from where he knows Spike. It helps that he never really looked at the subjects who are after all just animals to the Iniative. And, of course, Spike is wearing a very different outfit. :-) - And yes, Spike is staying with "Andrew" at the moment. :-)
A summary can be found here.
- Buffy really shouldn't be angry at Riley for not telling her about his double identity. I mean she's kept her secret as well. - But then her anger/disappoinment is not really about his double life. She feels that way because she finally wanted to have a normal relationship with a normal guy. (We've already seen that she would love to be a normal girl with a normal boyfriend in I Will Remember You on Angel. Buffy has forgotten about saying this, of course, but the wish is still there.)
- Amazing. Riley has never heard of the Slayer myth before.
Buffy: " [...] Look it up: Slayer comma the."
- It makes perfect sense that Buffy's scared of earthquakes. Dying on your 16th birthday will do that to you.
- Ah, parties at college. :-)
Willow: “Well, Porter dorm is completely blacked out. So naturally they are dealing with the crisis the only way they know how: ‘Aftershock Party’.”
Buffy: “Ah, this from the dorm that brought us the ‘Somebody Sneezed’ party and the ‘Day That Ends in Y’ party.”
Willow: “They do seem to be pretty generous with the milestones.
- So the Iniative considers demons to be like animals. It seems to me they haven't understood very much. The Council is not much better in that regard. The difference between these two institutions is that one is high tech and the other old fashioned. But both know nothing about their enemies.
After we've met Angel, Spike, Drusilla and Harmony amongst others one thing is certain: No vampire is alike. Without souls/chips they are dangerous predators, but they are still capable of feeling a wide range of emotions. Occasionally they are capable of love.
And nobody who's met Doyle could say that all demons are evil.
- Willow at the party: I totally sympathize. I hate going to parties without knowing anyone.
- O dear. Spike's new outfit is not really him. - The scene reminded me of the TNG show Deja Q where Q is forced to wear a hideous green jumpsuit. - To both Spike and Q appearances are very important though for slightly different reasons. Spike needs to be cool and Q needs perfection.
- Xander: “That’s it! I am way past due with you. I hate to break it to you, oh impotent one, but you’re not the big bad anymore, you’re not even the kind of naughty. You’re nothing but a waste of space – my space! And as much as I always got a big laugh watching Buffy kick your shiny white bum, as much as I know I can give you a little bum-kicking myself right now, I’m here to tell you something (He steps forward, right under the drip of water from the leaky pipe) You’re not even worth it. - I’m out of here.”
Xander's little speech to Spike must cut quite a bit. IMO, this is the first time you can catch a brief glimpse of William behind the Spike persona.
I mean we have seen Spike moaning over losing Drusilla, but in a way he was always in control. He was still Spike.
In this scene with Xander it becomes very clear to him that he's back to square one. Not only is he unable to be a vicious fighter, but he's also lost his cool. And all of a sudden, he's not so different from William, a persona he's tried to leave behind.
- Giles gets a wonderful line I'll have to memorize:
Giles: “I’m so very sorry. My contrition completely dwarfs the impending apocalypse.”
- During Riley's and Buffy's talk(s) I found this line very poignant:
Riley: "But I’m, by God, not going to walk away because I think it *might* not work."
I heart Angel, but that's more or less what he has done. Yes, yes, ending the relationship was all for Buffy's good, but as she says in this very episode she probably not getting older than 25. Shouldn't she get to decide with who she wants to spend her remaining years?
Riley: “Welcome to the story of the world. Things fall apart Buffy. And evil – it comes and goes. But the way people manage is, they don’t do it alone. They pull each other through. If you weren’t so self involved you’d see that. [...] But mostly I think you want to stay down in that dark place (Buffy stops to look at him and he steps in front of her) because maybe it’s safer down there.”
I don't agree with everything he says - Buffy's flaw is not that she's too self-centred, but apart from that he makes some valid points.
- Once more we get to see the difference between meetings of the scoobie gang and of the Iniative. The Initiative mostly concerns itself with measurements. Giles, Buffy and co. do their research in ancient books.
- I can't take Spike's suicide attempt too seriously. Yes, he feels useless, but if he really had tried to stake himself he could simply have put the stake into his heart. There's absolutely no need for the elaborate setup. I therefore view his suicide attempt as a cry for help. ;-)
- Love Xander's encouraging comment:
Xander puts an arm around Spike’s shoulder as they walk towards the steps: “Think of the happy. If we don’t find what we’re looking for, we face an apocalypse.”
Spike: “Really? You’re not just saying that?”
- Spike manages to get back to Xander and Willow. They've seen him when he was down - and Willow has dared to pity him. Since he can't bite them, he uses his next best weapon: Words.
Spike: “I should think you would be glad to greet the end of days. I mean, neither one of you is making much of a go at it. (Gestures at Xander) You. Kids your age are going off to University, you’ve made it as far as the basement. And Red here, - you couldn’t even keep dog-boy happy. You can take the loser out of high school, but...”
Willow: “I see what you’re doing. You’re trying to get us to dust you.”
Spike: “Am not! I just don’t want pity from geeks more useless than I am.”
Willow: “We’re not useless! We – we help people. We fight the forces of evil!”
Spike: “*Buffy* fights the forces of evil. You’re her groupies. She’d do just as well without you – better I’d wager, since she wouldn’t have to go about saving your hides all the time.”
Xander: “That is no not true! We’re part of the team. She needs us.”
Spike: “Or you’re just the same tenth grade losers you’ve always been, and she’s too much of a softy to cut you lose.”
Willow and Xander stand there speechless and after a moment Spike turns and walks on a satisfied grin spreading over his face.
I just knew he would use Willow's feelings for Oz at one point. The mark was just too good to miss.
- Spike finally realises that he can fight other demons and wins back his self-esteem. He totally defines himself by his fighting skills.
It's perfectly in character that he's fine with fighting other vampires/demons. Back in his pre-chip days, he also didn't get along with other vampires and had no scruples killing them, e.g. the "Annointed One". He's only loyal to himself and also Drusilla to a certain extent.
- I don't care for the final stunt, i.e. the last demon jumping into the hell-mouth, Buffy jumping in behind him and miraculously catching up with him in free fall. Very strange and defying all the laws of nature.
- Funny to see that Riley doesn't know from where he knows Spike. It helps that he never really looked at the subjects who are after all just animals to the Iniative. And, of course, Spike is wearing a very different outfit. :-) - And yes, Spike is staying with "Andrew" at the moment. :-)
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no subject
Date: 2005-11-24 01:01 am (UTC)Sadly this "people deciding what Buffy wants and making up their mind about it for her" will be a recurring theme, particularly in her love life.
I like your parallels b/t the Council and the Initiative (Council: :Wesley as Riley : : initiative -- I've got a sort of work in progress indirectly on this theme, as it involves backstory about Wesley's father working with Riley's grandfather). The Initiative is less willing to look at mystical explanations, but the council is as narrowminded in its own way.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-24 09:55 am (UTC)Yes, both Council and Iniative see the world in black & white. A demon/vampire is automatically bad or an animal. Wesley is different even when he arrives: I don't remember him giving Buffy a hard time regarding Angel. (Probably also helps that Angel saved his life early on.)
no subject
Date: 2005-11-24 02:00 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-26 11:42 pm (UTC)He's definitely one of my favorite characters.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-24 01:02 am (UTC)